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Thread: Felder's "Heaven and Hell" Discussion Thread

  1. #771
    Stuck on the Border VAisForEagleLovers's Avatar
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    Default Re: Felder's "Heaven and Hell" Discussion Thread

    It has always been my opinion, and I admit it's more of a gut feel than a true informed opinion, that Glenn, Don, and Irving finally settled for three main reasons. As you said, Dreamer, $3k meant they knew there'd likely be more later. Second, having actually go to court would have made public a lot of things, good, bad, and indifferent, that they prefer to keep private. Keeping in mind that these guys are just as private with the good things as the bad things, so wanting privacy doesn't mean they felt they were at fault in anything. Lastly, they wanted and needed to move forward with LROOE, and they couldn't do that with this hanging over their head. Besides legalities, they wanted it behind them, over and done with, and all talked out before promoting the album and touring.

    Given all that, they probably offered more than what they would have otherwise, and I feel that Felder accepted it because he either knew it was more money than he'd probably get in court, or because the legal aspect was costing more than he wanted to keep shelling out. Or both.

    Regardless of what side you're on, it's always the lawyers that make out the best.
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    Default Re: Felder's "Heaven and Hell" Discussion Thread

    Right, it didn't go to trial, but he did end up getting a massive settlement...where does your number come from though? There can't be any official source since none of the parties are allowed to comment. I hadn't heard that Felder had "violated a clause in his contract by refusing to surrender his shares in the band’s corporation upon his departure". Are you saying that all the partners had a clause saying that with a majority vote by other members they could be bought out for face value? Seems odd and a bit of a technicality anyway since the corporation he had a stake in was a shell by that time and that's what he sued them about really. I can't see how the fact that he didn't actually hand back his shares could have much traction in court.

    Quote Originally Posted by UndertheWire View Post
    Do you remember where this was? It's not one I've seen/heard (which only means I haven't found it online).
    It's been a while...I remember reading a long interview in July 1994, (Guitar Magazine ?) it might have been from there although I'm not quite clear why Frey would have been critical of Felder at that time, maybe they were recycling old quotes. I'll go looking!

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    Default Re: Felder's "Heaven and Hell" Discussion Thread

    Webvan – I’m not trying to be rude, but life is very hectic right now, so I really don’t have time to go through all the details of the lawsuit. However, all of the information that I know can be found in this thread or in Felder’s book. But I'll try to respond to your direct questions. I’m almost sure that the amount of Felder’s original lawsuit can be verified here or in his book. As for the settlement amount, you are correct that the actual amount was undisclosed. However, at the time of the settlement, it was presumed and speculated to be somewhere between $20 - $30 million. As I said, whether this is a massive amount or not is debatable. To me, it is an enormous amount of money, but if I bring it down to numbers I can wrap my head around, I, personally, would consider it a very hollow victory to settle for 10 - 15% of what I had originally asked for. In other words, if I believed I deserved $20,000 in a lawsuit and only ended up with $2,000 or $3,000, I think I’d be very disappointed.

    As far as the clause in his contract regarding his shares, he also writes about that in his book. If I recall correctly, the contract required departing members to sell their shares back to the corporation for a nominal sum. Again, we’ll never know, but it is incumbent upon the court to follow the letter of the law, so I seriously doubt that any deemed breach of contract would have been swept under the carpet in litigation.

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    Default Re: Felder's "Heaven and Hell" Discussion Thread

    Not rude at all, thanks for discussing these points further, I'll go back to Felder's book when I get a chance, maybe more info was given in the original version that was recalled. I think we all agree that the whole thing was a mess and that in the end it's the fans who lost out by no longer being able to enjoy the "Hotel California" version of the band.

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    Default Re: Felder's "Heaven and Hell" Discussion Thread

    Webvan, I tried to respond the first time that you wrote about the fans being the ones who lost out, but I had problems with posting.

    I don't see it that way. Typically, bands don't last that long and they rarely stick with the same line-up for a long period. We have the "classic" period and anything beyond that is a bonus.

    If you look at the reunion, the Eagles completed the HFO tour and then did very little together before they ditched Felder. A couple of benefits, the Hall of Fame appearance, three millenium concerts and an aborted attempt to record new material is all they had to show for five years. In the thirteen years since Felder's departure they've been far more active with touring and releasing a double album. So in that respect, fans are the winners.

    Fans of Don Felder get to enjoy his latest album and catch him on tour at a lower price than if he'd still been with the Eagles.

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    Default Re: Felder's "Heaven and Hell" Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by webvan View Post
    Not rude at all, thanks for discussing these points further, I'll go back to Felder's book when I get a chance, maybe more info was given in the original version that was recalled. I think we all agree that the whole thing was a mess and that in the end it's the fans who lost out by no longer being able to enjoy the "Hotel California" version of the band.
    I hate to be pedantic but the Hotel Califorina version of the band ceased to exist when Meisner was replaced by Schmit.

    I saw Felder on the HFO tour & I have stated on numerous occasions that I don't feel that I lost out after that at all. See UTW's comments above.

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    Default Re: Felder's "Heaven and Hell" Discussion Thread

    Personally I don't believe for a second that Don F had Randy, Bernie, Joe and Timothy in mind when he prepared for the "battle". And I have always hated that "My Lord, don't you realize?" in his book that he claims to have said to Timothy. He may have said something like it to get Timothy on his side, but I don't believe that he was that dramatic. But it does look effective in the book, of course.

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    Default Re: Felder's "Heaven and Hell" Discussion Thread

    Does any one have any educated guesses on how much they settled for? I've always wondered approximately how much Felder won from the lawsuit.

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    Default Re: Felder's "Heaven and Hell" Discussion Thread

    I'm guessing it was a complex settlement that is ongoing and that has had to take into consideration royalties from digital sales and other new and emerging media. As much as Don and Glenn would have liked to pay one lump sum and be done with it, comments from both sides lead me to believe that the case is not over and there are still entanglements. The value of any lump sum payment that was initially paid out may end up paling in comparison to Felder's eventual compensation, as part of the settlement, from royalties. I doubt he agreed to give up any elements of future royalties from sources and media that didn't even exist in the first part of this century.

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    Default Re: Felder's "Heaven and Hell" Discussion Thread

    Mary...I agree with your assessment, especially with the categorization of "complex". The legal fight, even though sparked by hurt and anger, is not about what happened or personal relationships but what will happen with the future financial returns (which will continue beyond their lifetimes). The stakes are so high it is unlikely a good attorney would allow the initial settlement to be the end of the case.

    I am only partly thru reading the book. So far my thoughts are that Don Felder seems to have a rationalization for any of his bad behavior. It is amazing how many prominent musicians' paths crossed in their younger years. Don Felder is an amazing guitarist by all counts. Bernie is a really nice guy, honest, talented and a good friend. Don's derogatory comments mainly focus on Glenn but the direct quotes from Glenn included in the book do not make Glenn appear unreasonable and even demonstrate his sense of humor. Youth, drugs, fame, creativity all added to the crazy mix (good and bad).

    I can't help but think that Irving should have facilitated better communication and brokered a deliniation of responsibilities and compensation. He was supposed to be everyone's manager but comes across in the book as merely being the messenger. He could have mediate creative differences. Rather than dismiss Don F's requests for info, he could have helped Don F look at the business side from a different perspective. Glenn and Don H set the goal of the band creatively and focused on a business plan. All in the band benefited from their ideas, extra time and connections so maybe additional compensation was reasonable. The other band members are relieved of dealing with business entanglements yet benefit financially and are free to concentrate on their music. Everybody wins, including Irving. Right now the big winners may be the lawyers!

    Back to reading now. I have always loved the music but didn't really follow the personal lives of the band members until now, learning alot.

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