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Thread: Why I no longer am happy with my favorite band

  1. #1
    Border Desperado Vector's Avatar
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    Unhappy Why I no longer am happy with my favorite band

    I am like many of you, having grown up on the Eagles and consider them one of, if not my overall favorite band. I do not need to explain why as most here are probably shaking their heads in agreement.

    When they split back in 1980 I was not happy, but beyond being deprived of any new music from them, I didn't really care why they broke up. To me, they were just like many other groups who split for one reason or another. However I always said that if they ever did get back together, even if it was a special one off concert, I'd get tickets and fly almost anywhere to see them.
    Of course when they went on tour to promote Hell Freezes Over, I was lucky enough to have them come to Miami, where they were flawless. I got a kick out of how they said "we never broke up, just went on a 14 year vacation". That combined with the name of their CD playing off of Henley's infamous comment, I could not imagine a better way to reunite and put the past behind them.

    Based on the aforementioned you may be wondering where I have lost the faith so to speak. The reason is that I have now gotten to know why they broke up, and more about them on an individual basis. I probably would not have cared that much, but like many of you, I've watched "History of the Eagles" on Showtime. I decided to watch it not for their personal back story, but rather hoping to catch some unreleased footage, and maybe some insight on how certain songs/albums came together. After watching both parts, many things did not add up to me, so having it On Demand, I watched it again. All of a sudden I found myself getting annoyed at certain members of the band, and feeling sorry for others.
    So even though this documentary was in their own words, and presumably edited with their input, I decided to delve into other sources of information to see if it could help me get my mind around what seemed like glaring inconsistencies.

    To that end, I decided to read the following books, but I got them from the library rather than buy them(more on that later);

    The Eagles/Vaughan
    The Eagles/Jackson
    Heaven & Hell/Felder

    I intend on reading;

    To The Limit/Eliot

    But it is on backlog in the public library system. I also watched the 60 Minutes special and read at least a dozen past and present articles about them as a group and individually. I even joined this forum more as a source of research than intending on being an active member.
    Keep in mind that I just finished reading all of the above and watching the Doc & 60 Minutes within the last few weeks, so everything is very fresh in my mind.

    Finally, before I get to my conclusions/viewpoint and ask for other posters thoughts, let me make an observation and disclosure. My observation about some of the forum members here is that they love a particular member of the Eagles, and are quick to rush to their defense. That of course is typical of a fan who will always see things from a biased perspective. It is no different than a sports fan who always thinks the close calls are in favor of their team.
    For me, I never really had a favorite band member, nor a particular member I could relate to more than any other.
    Heck, other than Henley & Frey, I did not even know any of the other members names before they broke up in 1980. So I am about as unbiased a source as you can get when it comes to individual members.

    Even my favorite songs seem to be evenly split between different vocalists and/or creative members behind the songs.
    For example, and in no special order, my top 5 songs by them are as follows;

    One Of These Nights/Henley
    Take It Easy/Frey
    Hotel California/Felder
    Take It To The Limit/Meisner

    Tequila Sunrise/Frey * Mainly because my son was born to this song

    So if I had a positive bias at all, it might be a slight leaning toward Frey because he sings the song my son was born to. {I am just glad it was not to Desperado, as their greatest hits CD was playing on random in the background}

    It might therefore come as a surprise to some, that despite Frey being the main guy who formed the original group members, I believe him to be the main reason for their overall problems and dissension.
    While the following list is not meant to say he, and he alone is solely responsible, it shows where he is the primary antagonist;

    Despite two successful albums and a 3rd in the works, he is the main guy to butt heads with Glyn Johns.

    He was the main guy to butt heads with Geffen, and told Azoff to file suit and leave.

    He is the main guy to come into conflict with Bernie Leadon, which ultimately led to a confrontation and Leadon leaving the band.

    He is the main guy to come into conflict with Randy Meisner, which again led to a confrontation and Meisner leaving the band.

    He is the main guy to come into conflict with Don Felder, which once again led to a confrontation, and ultimately led to the dissolution of the band.

    When the other members wanted to get beyond the Long Run tour/blowup, Frey was the one who called it quits.

    Years later when four of the five Eagles were in the studio to re-unite, it was Frey who left them standing at the alter.

    When he finally decided to rejoin the Eagles, it was his demand that he and Henley get more money than the others, thereby sowing the seeds of future discontent.

    After they had gotten back together, he once again was the main guy who was involved with the conflict and firing of Don Felder.

    Despite all of the above as it pertains to Frey, this alone would not put me off to the overall band. However the power struggles (which include Henley), conflict, hypocrisy, ungratefulness, greed and other unsavory things I've become aware of have decidedly left a bad taste in my mouth.

    The last straw for me involves their political leanings, which seems to have been a part of them from the early 1970's. While I imagine many groups of that era voted for and supported Democrats, the Eagles seem to be in a class unto themselves when it comes to liberal kooks. Jerry Brown was and is a left wing loon, and Alan Cranston was about as liberal of a senator as they come.
    It is to such a great degree that I do not want to put any more of my hard earned dollars in the Eagles coffers. So rather than me buying any of the aforementioned books, I got them from the library. Had I not been able to watch and record the Doc with my DVR, I would never have paid for it precisely for the same reason.
    Now this is of course a free country, and people are free to support and vote for whomever they choose. Yet the Eagles have gone well beyond their individual support and votes for liberals. They did and continue to actively try to use their fame for political causes, thereby undermining those with whom I might politically support.

    As an FYI, I am not a hardline right winger, and have voted for both Democrats & Republicans. But it sickens me when the ignorant and naive Hollywood types use the platform they've achieved (because of their artistic abilities) to try and influence the rest of us. This is also true of those who vocally support hardline right wingers, but they are few and far between in the music and acting industry.

    I still love to listen to the Eagles older music, as does my son who was raised listening to my CD's. Sadly for me, I was fairly naive as to who they were, what they did, and what they stood for. There is a part of me that wishes I did not get the bug to find out more about them after watching the documentary. After all, entertainers can be an escape from our day to day reality, and should not be taken to seriously.
    Yet there is no escaping how hypocritical the two leaders of the Eagles are, along with their beloved manager Irving Azoff. They formed a band with an equal membership in mind because they did not like the feeling of being sidemen themselves.
    Yet the greed and hubris caused Frey and to a certain extent Henley to become exactly what they despised in the early days. As a result, the magic the Eagles possessed that made them our beloved band, was the cause of them falling apart and depriving us of that great early combination of talent. We will never know how many other great hits were never to be recorded as a result.

    Needless to say, I am interested in your points of view on my lengthy OP.

    `

  2. #2
    Border Desperado pueblo47's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why I no longer am happy with my favorite band

    I have no problem with your post other than to correct a name: it's Bernie L eadon, not Bernie Felder.
    So if you see me walking all alone, don't look back. I'm just on my way back home.

  3. #3
    Border Troubadour Annabel's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why I no longer am happy with my favorite band

    When I saw it Judy, post one said 'Bernie Leadon, not Bernie Felder' and post two said 'Bernie Leadon not Felder.' Neither said what they say now for sure.
    Melanie



  4. #4
    Border Troubadour Annabel's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why I no longer am happy with my favorite band

    Erm, my altered post doesn't even make sense now lol. Whatever.
    Melanie



  5. #5
    Stuck on the Border Henley Honey's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why I no longer am happy with my favorite band

    I don't agree with you at all, Vector. The band is a business -- just like a bakery is a business. Just because their "product" strikes a place in your soul rather than your stomach, doesn't mean it isn't first and foremost a business.

    Frey & Henley as equal managing partners started the business with a shared vision. Each brought individual strengths and weaknesses to the partnership and between them had sufficient drive and determination to make it happen and reach their goals. If a business is to be successfully maintained or substantially increased, then change is inevitable. If their relationships with Glyn Johns, Geffen, Bernie and Felder were not in the best interest of the business as they saw it, then things needed to be changed.

    Felder might have been the greatest guitar player on the planet, but if you are trying to run a successful business and you have an employee whose behavior on a day-to-day basis is derisive and contrary, then things need to be changed.

    IMO, Glenn was and continues to be the driving force behind the band. He has fought to maintain his and Henley's original vision. I don't see him as the primary antagonist. I see him as a smart and savvy businessman who has also proved himself as an extraordinary musician, composer and arranger.

    As far as their "political leanings" I'm glad that they are not complacent in this area. I'm glad that they are concerned about the world that they and their children live in. If their higher profile gives them greater influence to bring about change and they use that influence when and how they choose, then good for them.

    Just my opinion.
    Last edited by Henley Honey; 04-14-2013 at 10:40 AM.

  6. #6
    Stuck on the Border Prettymaid's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why I no longer am happy with my favorite band

    Lol! Apparently there are glitches left over from April Fool's Day.
    ~ Cathy ~

    And I dream I'm on vacation 'Cause I like the way that sounds,
    It's a perfect occupation for me.

  7. #7
    Administrator sodascouts's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why I no longer am happy with my favorite band

    I'm sorry for this bizarre glitch... I removed the variable replacement code on April 2 but it still seems to be happening almost randomly?? I'll try to figure out what the problem is. Until then - and I know this is annoying but - I suggest you put a space between "L" and "eadon" so that the line of code instructing all variables of "Lead0n" to be changed to "Felder" will not activate.

    ie L eadon.

    Always in our hearts, Never forgotten

  8. #8
    Stuck on the Border Tiffanny Twisted's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why I no longer am happy with my favorite band

    Quote Originally Posted by Henley Honey View Post
    I don't agree with you at all, Vector. The band is a business -- just like a bakery is a business. Just because their "product" strikes a place in your soul rather than your stomach, doesn't mean it isn't first and foremost a business.

    Frey & Henley as equal managing partners started the business with a shared vision. Each brought individual strengths and weaknesses to the partnership and between them had sufficient drive and determination to make it happen and reach their goals. If a business is to be successfully maintained or substantially increased, then change is inevitable. If their relationships with Glyn Johns, Geffen, Bernie and Felder were not in the best interest of the business as they saw it, then things needed to be changed.

    Felder might have been the greatest guitar player on the planet. But if your are trying to run a successful business and you have an employee whose behavior on a day-to-day basis is derisive and contrary, then things need to be changed.

    IMO, Glenn was and continues to be the driving force behind the band. He has fought to maintain his and Henley's original vision. I don't see him as the primary antagonist. I see him as a smart and savvy businessman who has also proved himself as an extraordinary musician, composer and arranger.

    As far as their "political leanings" I'm glad that they are not complacent in this area. I'm glad that they are concerned about the world that they and their children live in. If their higher profile gives them greater influence to bring about change and they use that influence when and how they choose, then good for them.

    Just my opinion.
    very well said hh..i agree

  9. #9
    Administrator sodascouts's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why I no longer am happy with my favorite band

    Welcome, Vector! Although I am saddened by your disillusionment with the band, I respect the amount of time and thought you put into your post.

    If you cannot appreciate a band's music any longer because you do not like certain members' personalities/actions, then that is your right and I certainly am not going to try to convince you that such a viewpoint is invalid.

    For me, I accept that even people who don't share my viewpoints or behave in ways I approve of can make terrific music. Now, it's true I won't listen to bands who worship the devil (even if it's just a gimmick - thank God by the time I was old enough to appreciate rock, most musicians no longer found it "cool" to pretend to be Satanists). However, I also don't approve of drug use, but if I were to refuse to listen to any musician who ever did drugs, I would have a pretty empty CD shelf.

    Anyway, although it probably won't make you change your mind, I think you might be oversimplifying a bit when it comes to couple of your points.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vector
    Despite two successful albums and a 3rd in the works, [Glenn] is the main guy to butt heads with Glyn Johns
    While Glenn was definitely the main guy butting heads with Glyn Johns at the outset, when Desperado flopped, even Bernie - who was Johns' favorite - was saying "Glyn Johns missed it." And, as much as I love it (it's my favorite Eagles album), Desperado was most definitely not a successful album commercially.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vector
    [Glenn] was the main guy to butt heads with Geffen, and told Azoff to file suit and leave.
    I assume you got this out of one of the books you read, since it wasn't in the documentary... could you remind me what your source/evidence is for this conclusion? Based on the documentary, Glenn was the reason they went to Geffen in the first place, and they all were fine with him until Geffen sold Asylum (Geffen left, not them). After Geffen left, they wanted their publishing money back and Geffen refused. That's why the lawsuit was filed... not because of some personal vendetta by Glenn.

    As for the rest, Glenn definitely was involved in the band member conflicts, but he was the leader. The leader is the one who has to deal with things like Randy freaking out and refusing to perform his job, or Felder being dissatisfied and refusing to sign his contract.

    Regarding politics....

    I understand where you're coming from in a way. My parents are extremely conservative Republicans and I used to be one. While I became disenchanted with the party and became an independent, I am by no means a liberal either. I'm kind of an issues voter nowadays, I guess. What I've never done, though, is "punish" people who disagree with me politically by refusing to patronize their businesses/buy their products. I'm not saying you're wrong for doing that, but for me, we shouldn't just define people by their political party. That kind of thinking has led to a divisive spirit that is tearing this nation apart.... but I digress.

    Now, if these guys start preaching to me at a show, that does piss me off because I don't need to be told what to think by a rock star - or anyone else, for that matter. Political pontification at shows brings me down when I'm trying to enjoy myself, especially because it's usually negative in tone (anything from snarky derision to angry rants). Thankfully, that rarely happens at an Eagles show.

    I have friends on both sides of the aisle. The only people I distance myself from are hateful extremists. The Eagles are certainly not that! Regarding your examples: Jerry Brown has been kissing up to musicians (literally in some cases *cough*Linda Ronstadt*cough*) for decades. Have you also sworn off the other legions of 70s musicians Brown has gotten money from? If so, fine, but it's quite a few! The Eagles supported Cranston because he was anti-nuclear. It turns out that he also happened to be very corrupt, but how were they to know that? They were young and naive. Although many musicians often like to think they are more politically savvy than your average joe (hence the occasional pontification from the stage), they can be sold a bill of goods just like anybody else. The important thing is that they were trying to help make the world a better place. There's nothing wrong with that in my view.

    But again, you have every right to your view.

    Always in our hearts, Never forgotten

  10. #10
    Border Troubadour Annabel's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why I no longer am happy with my favorite band

    Quote Originally Posted by sodascouts View Post
    I'm sorry for this bizarre glitch... I removed the variable replacement code on April 2 but it still seems to be happening almost randomly?? I'll try to figure out what the problem is. Until then - and I know this is annoying but - I suggest you put a space between "L" and "eadon" so that the line of code instructing all variables of "Leadon" to be changed to "Felder" will not activate.

    ie L eadon.
    Ah yes the April Fools Day joke. I forgot about that. Funny thing is Soda, when you reply on this thread but scroll down, the previous posts show the real post not the altered one. (IYSWIM) I thought I was going mad for a while but it makes sense now.
    Melanie



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